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Extraction Summary
5
People
2
Organizations
0
Locations
1
Events
3
Relationships
3
Quotes
Document Information
Type:
Legal document
File Size:
618 KB
Summary
This document is a court transcript from a case filed on December 10, 2021. Attorneys Ms. Menninger and Mr. Rohrbach are arguing before the court about the nature of a witness, Mr. Flatley. The central issue is whether Mr. Flatley will testify as a fact witness or an expert witness regarding his methods for user data extraction, and whether sufficient notice was provided to the opposing side.
People (5)
| Name | Role | Context |
|---|---|---|
| Mr. Flatley | Witness |
Subject of a discussion about whether he is a fact witness or an expert witness regarding the extraction of user data...
|
| Mr. Kelso | Witness |
Mentioned as a point of comparison for Mr. Flatley's potential testimony.
|
| MS. MENNINGER | Attorney |
Speaker in the transcript, arguing that the government has not provided sufficient notice about the nature of Mr. Fla...
|
| THE COURT | Judge |
Speaker in the transcript, questioning whether Mr. Flatley is being used as an expert witness.
|
| MR. ROHRBACH | Attorney |
Speaker in the transcript, responding to the court that Mr. Flatley is primarily a fact witness but that they have gi...
|
Organizations (2)
| Name | Type | Context |
|---|---|---|
| government | government agency |
Mentioned as the entity providing '3500 material' and identifying evidence.
|
| SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C. | company |
Listed at the bottom of the page, likely the court reporting service that transcribed the proceeding.
|
Timeline (1 events)
2021-12-10
A discussion in court regarding the nature of Mr. Flatley's testimony, specifically whether he is a fact witness or an expert witness, and if proper notice was provided for his testimony on data extraction.
Courtroom
Relationships (3)
They are opposing counsel in a legal proceeding, arguing different positions before the court regarding the testimony of a witness, Mr. Flatley.
Ms. Menninger is an attorney addressing the judge ('Your Honor') to make a legal argument.
Mr. Rohrbach is an attorney responding to a direct question from the judge.
Key Quotes (3)
"Your Honor, the 3500 material doesn't say Mr. Flatley is going to describe the extraction of user data this way."Source
— MS. MENNINGER
(Arguing that the provided discovery materials do not adequately describe the scope of Mr. Flatley's expected testimony.)
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Quote #1
"Well, I have to go back and look at the notice. But are you using Flatley as an expert?"Source
— THE COURT
(Questioning the legal team about the classification of their witness, Mr. Flatley.)
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Quote #2
"We think Mr. Flatley is primarily a fact witness, but the line between a fact witness in a setting like this and someone testifying on the basis of their expertise is not well settled, and so we've given expert notice"Source
— MR. ROHRBACH
(Explaining their position on Mr. Flatley's role, acknowledging the ambiguity between a fact and expert witness in this context.)
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Quote #3
Full Extracted Text
Complete text extracted from the document (1,832 characters)
Case 1:20-cr-00330-PAE Document 536 Filed 12/10/21 Page 23 of 43 23
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1 and the extraction of metadata as his expert testimony,
2 Mr. Flatley's views on those questions should be available
3 through the 3500 material and through his other expert
4 testimony, so there's really no need for any sort of further
5 identification by the government of anything before Mr. Kelso
6 should be able to let us know his views on those questions.
7 MS. MENNINGER: Your Honor, the 3500 material doesn't
8 say Mr. Flatley is going to describe the extraction of user
9 data this way. He's talked about the fact that he has observed
10 the user data, but he hasn't talked about the methods that he's
11 used it. It's not that type of 3500 material from the
12 government. So I don't agree that we could tell from what they
13 have provided thus far exactly what Mr. Flatley's testimony is
14 going to be.
15 And frankly, they said Mr. Flatley was largely a fact
16 witness as well. So if I'm understanding now that they're
17 intending to offer something along the lines Mr. Kelso is, they
18 didn't provide sufficient notice for Mr. Flatley's expertise in
19 that area either.
20 THE COURT: Well, I have to go back and look at the
21 notice. But are you using Flatley as an expert?
22 MR. ROHRBACH: We think Mr. Flatley is primarily a
23 fact witness, but the line between a fact witness in a setting
24 like this and someone testifying on the basis of their
25 expertise is not well settled, and so we've given expert notice
2 Mr. Flatley's views on those questions should be available
3 through the 3500 material and through his other expert
4 testimony, so there's really no need for any sort of further
5 identification by the government of anything before Mr. Kelso
6 should be able to let us know his views on those questions.
7 MS. MENNINGER: Your Honor, the 3500 material doesn't
8 say Mr. Flatley is going to describe the extraction of user
9 data this way. He's talked about the fact that he has observed
10 the user data, but he hasn't talked about the methods that he's
11 used it. It's not that type of 3500 material from the
12 government. So I don't agree that we could tell from what they
13 have provided thus far exactly what Mr. Flatley's testimony is
14 going to be.
15 And frankly, they said Mr. Flatley was largely a fact
16 witness as well. So if I'm understanding now that they're
17 intending to offer something along the lines Mr. Kelso is, they
18 didn't provide sufficient notice for Mr. Flatley's expertise in
19 that area either.
20 THE COURT: Well, I have to go back and look at the
21 notice. But are you using Flatley as an expert?
22 MR. ROHRBACH: We think Mr. Flatley is primarily a
23 fact witness, but the line between a fact witness in a setting
24 like this and someone testifying on the basis of their
25 expertise is not well settled, and so we've given expert notice
SOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.
(212) 805-0300
(212) 805-0300
DOJ-OGR-00008333
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